Here is a transcript generated by of The Content Mix podcast interview with VeraContent’s Kyler Canastra and Hayley Collingswood,Group Head of Marketing at Ventur, on the importance of creative courage in marketing:

Kyler Canastra 0:13
Hi everyone, I’m Kyler from The Content Mix, and on today’s episode I’m joined by Hayley Collingswood Group Head of Marketing at Ventur. After completing a bachelor’s degree in graphic communication and design from the University of Leeds in the UK, Hayley is set out to disrupt the world of marketing. From working as an account manager for agencies such as Turn Key to her current role at Ventur. Hayley’s diverse career journey has given her the opportunity to explore the world of marketing and brand management, catapulting her career and allowing her to excel in her craft. Now she works at Ventur, a travel management brand that promises its customers a seamless and exceptional travel experience, something we’re all looking forward to as the world slowly opens up again. So let’s get the ball rolling, and welcome Hayley to the show. So thank you so much for joining us today, Hayley. Yeah, thank you for having me. It’s our pleasure. Just to get started, can you introduce yourself in your own words, I just gave you that nice introduction. But it’d be great to hear from you to hear more about where you’re from, and what’s your connection to marketing in Europe and in the UK?

Hayley Collingswood 1:15
Yeah, so I guess I’ve always worked in the UK on sale at university here and kind of got straight into the industry from there. I suppose my background is that I started in design. So I really kind of had a passion for that starting early on. And then as I left university, I sort of wanted to get more into the strategic side of things. And so now when I myself, I sort of see myself as a bit of a brand advocate, somebody who like really believes in the power of branding, and that’s something that I take for in in my entire career, but also on my roles that moment.

Kyler Canastra 1:51
Was that something you like expected to get involved in when you graduated or kind of life took you in certain directions?

Hayley Collingswood 1:57
I think it just sort of happened differently. I suppose like, I The reason I wanted to go into design is because I used to love reading magazines, which sounds a bit weird now in the digital age, and but yeah, when I was growing up as a teenager, I just loved like glossy outfits and that kind of thing. I was like kind of want to be involved in that I want to be in my art direction and design. And that’s what led me to do that university. But then I did a year in industry during University. And I was like, Okay, well, I’m not getting involved in the like, really interesting kind of strategic stuff. And I want to get to the heart of like, you know, the why and the how am I going to tackle this challenge? And that kind of thing, which I think you get a lot of at university. But actually, when you go into the real world as a junior designer, you don’t you don’t get into that kind of stuff. No. So that’s why when I left, I was like, Well, actually, I want to be on the account management side, because they go into all the interested meetings and getting to make all the cool decisions. And so I was just like, yeah, I want to do that. And I guess, naturally ends up going in house and working on big brand projects they read for the brands themselves, rather than multiple brands at one time.

Kyler Canastra 3:06
Cool. And it’s like really interesting to see, I feel like a lot of times when we’re like looking at a magazine, no one’s really thinking about like, I wanted to, like make that campaign or why is that the way it is we kind of just like consume it. So it’s really cool how like a passion that you had kind of has driven, you know, throughout your career. And I think a lot of times when we graduate, we’re always like, we have to do like what we graduate, like our degree is what we I mean, at least in Europe, that’s kind of like the the mindset, at least at least in southern Europe, and then from coming from the US, and I’m sure in the UK, it’s not always like that. They always say like, I mean, I studied Spanish and history doesn’t mean I went I went into marketing and sales. And here we are. So it’s kind of nice to see kind of how your passion has pushed you throughout your career. Now, so you’ve been quoted as someone who’s ethos hinges on the power of brand and creating affinity that goes far beyond product and price. So for you, what does that mean?

Hayley Collingswood 3:57
Yeah, I just think that’s such a big problem these days, people just get, you know, wrapped up in that sell, sell, sell, and how can we get these conversions and that kind of thing, and really sidelines the fact that actually, if your brand isn’t right, if your customer has no affinity to your brand and has no other reason to want to buy from you, then you’re on the backfoot hugely. You might get some sales, but if you actually take the time to sort out your brand first it can really like amplify all the other activity that you’re doing and really make it all sort of come together much more nicely in and I suppose like first and I’m just thinking particularly about where I am at the minute at Ventur. Like we were in a situation where we had a brand that it was attracting completely the wrong audience, not the wrong audience. audience that we wanted really moving forward so so it really was an opportunity to completely chang the positioning of the brand to to really kind of cherry pick the clients that we have that you know we really really value but grow that instead of like ending up with the clientele that isn’t out quite right for our business, and that will be better served by another brand. So, though it really like I, what I find so interesting about branding is it is such a huge part of our entire business and their entire strategy. And I think, you know, you sort of forget that at your peril. Really?

Kyler Canastra 5:19
Yeah. It’s really cool like that kind of, I don’t know, your mindset towards branding is that, like, you have to grow it and let it happen organically. And I think that’s something that kind of we can apply across the board, whether it comes to like SEO, for example, if like, people want SEO, and blog posts, and they want results right away, but it’s like, No, you have to build that up and let it happen. Or like when trying to like get a new client, it’s kind of you can say no to a client, you don’t have to say yes to everything, so that you’re working with people that will be beneficial in the long term. I think that’s something that we can apply right to, like our mindset nowadays, where we have like social media and everything so fast, and you have Amazon and everything, like instantaneous, but we actually have to take the time to build and grow internally before like sharing that with the world. I think that’s really, really cool. That’s your approach.

Hayley Collingswood 6:03
Yeah. And, like completely shapes the quality as well of what you get, like, for example, we’re working on PPC at the minute. And it’s so important to us that we’re presenting ourselves as the brand that we want to be and that a lot of our activity at the minute is about building up the profile of the brand and and sort of saying to the world, hey, hey, we’re different from everyone. Because we we want, we don’t want to get any old, you know, PPC leads, you know, it’s important that there are value to us. And so it all flows through right, right down to the super tactical stuff. But if your brands right, you know what you’re doing all the way through, making it up as you go.

Kyler Canastra 6:45
Yeah, if you have a solid brand to you know, you’re talking about and everyone in the company will be on the same page as well, whether they’re in sales, or you know, in marketing or any other department, they’re going to know how to represent the brand in a very easy way. And that’s why it’s good to actually take the time to create that brand. And that image, as well. Now, as you mentioned before, to like drag your career, you’ve been involved in design and marketing and account management of various companies. And I was like one thing that really stuck out and made me excited to talk to you because you have all these different, I don’t know you’ve been involved in different things and kind of brought them all together. And you’ve worked in different industries and organizations. So have you found like having that diverse skill set and being exposed to many different things that you found that to be helpful for you and your career today? Like now at Ventur?

Hayley Collingswood 7:29
Yeah, absolutely. I think, you know, as well as branding, I suppose something that’s always been important to me, it’s been really strong creative. And I think obviously, having started in design, really sort of Roman appreciation for what that takes and how strong creative can be both through university and through my placement year. And then moving into Client Services and working for multiple brands and working so closely with those designers to get to that sort of creative conclusion. But that really actually works and hits nail on the head, like, I’ve been in the thick of it, and I completely understand now. And then when it comes to me briefing an agency or creative team on what we’re looking to achieve, and I know what they need to know, and I can be articulate about that. And I’m confident in kind of, I suppose, like taking the project through to its final conclusion that and like you said earlier, like, I’m not afraid to say no, like, we’re not there yet. We’re not hitting the nail on the head. And I think that that takes courage in itself. And confidence in your own beliefs about what what craves should be and how strong it

Kyler Canastra 8:42
should be. And it gives you like a sort of kind of type of empathy, no, like you can if you’re like working with graphic designers, like you know what it’s like, so you can sympathize with them. I feel like sometimes you have like, you’re working with the agency, and then like that client for the agency has no idea how it works, and they’re being very demanding. And then they can talk to you and feel comfortable with you being like, she knows what’s going on. And she can sympathize with us in a way. So it’s really cool. It helps. Yeah,

Hayley Collingswood 9:09
I think that helps like having that understanding. And it does help you to build a bit more of a report because you you showing that you understand what it takes, but in the same way like that, you know, it is important to to say look, I completely get it. We’re just not there yet. Like, you know, put the cards on out on the table. Don’t try and second guess what the solution is just say, this is the situation. It’s not quite working yet. But if we all pull together, let’s go back to the drawing board. Let’s make it happen. And it’s about seeing I hate the whole idea about you know, it being us and them like by the agency and that kind of thing. And I think actually it’s so much more productive if you can create that sort of mindset that you are all actually one team and you know, it’s not you guys go away and come back with something else. You know, I think is collaborative. And the more that I can give them we can give my team can give to that. And then the better result we’re going to get together.

Kyler Canastra 10:10
Exactly. And that makes because I work at an agency. So we’ve had many issues with that before when they don’t understand us and them. And I think what now that I’m like working in the sales side of thing for the same agency, I really tried to push that with the client. And we’re in the beginning, it’s like, we want to be part of your team, like we are an extension of your team, because we are going to get your goal done together. Like, that’s why you work with agency to help you get achieve the same goal. And if you do like that kind of collaboration, I think it’s so important. Now, you mentioned or you alluded to this rebranding at Ventur that have been happening over the past year, and you were a critical part to its success, because you share a bit more in general, I guess, about what Ventur does, what went into this successful brand launch activation and maybe kind of what the brand was before and what is is now?

Hayley Collingswood 10:55
Yeah, of course, yeah, so actually Ventur not been the name for that long. We’re saying when we rebranded it to so we were called Truffle Leads before which and the name to be honest, we just found it didn’t work, it created a lot of confusion and issues. And we felt like we could come up with something much stronger. So Truffle Leads, has sort of, I guess, three main promise to the business. So the first is like business travel. So we work with some really huge brands, doing all their travel, getting them all across the world, no matter where they need to be. And that’s for a lot of our clients. So that’s been throughout the pandemic, pandemic results have been essential workers, right. So all that to say, you can imagine the complications and trying to get people back for that. There’s been a few stories of you know, trying to get one person from A to B, and they’ve had to go by like six different countries to gal. Yeah, that was like, the early days. Obviously, it’s got better now, but you know, our team are very, very skilled at what they do. And a big part of the brand is the consultancy and the advice. And it’s it’s not a self serve digital model. Like that’s not who we are, it is about that kind of personal consultancy with what they need and offering that added value. So, so yeah, we have the business side. And then we also do professional sports travel. So we do a lot of our national teams, and we’ll do the England cricket team and things like that. So yeah, we’re flying them all over the world all the time.

Kyler Canastra 12:32
And you’re organizing, like every aspect of that trip. Right? From validation to the flights to the transport everything.

Hayley Collingswood 12:40
Absolutely. And also, it’s like all the equipment, you don’t appreciate all the baggage and like negotiating with the airlines. But how are we going to get there, sometimes we need to do charter flights for teams, sometimes not we literally, to the detail of like, if we order this coach, Will it fit through the stadium, when they get there, we’ve got to make sure everything is perfect. Because at the end of the day, those athletes like they didn’t want to be thinking, you know about this, they just want to get that and be in the mindset to be ready to perform and to do their job. And again, that’s a big part of what we tried to do is we’re sort of making the whole process seamless and effortless for you so that you can focus on your job and you’re not getting caught up in the things that actually you can just let us handle that. And, and that’s where the consultancy comes in. Because it’s like we’re actually trusted to deliver that rather than it just being sort of left, left to happen.

Kyler Canastra 13:36
Now, that’s really cool. And interesting. Actually, you don’t think about these things, right? When I mean, when a person books, their own trip, there’s like, okay, I just do the flight accommodation, and we’ll figure it out. But you’re thinking about every little detail, which is cool. So I guess how did that like, okay, you’re rebranding the company and kind of, kind of, I guess repositioning it in a different way. So how did that kind of go into like the brand activation and your whole plan? I guess for that?

Hayley Collingswood 14:00
Yeah. So I think the first thing we really wanted to do was do the research and get the insight about, about who we were what we were delivering for our customers and where the opportunity was market and a sales, job management. It’s been quite a corporate dated market in general. And certainly like our role brands was definitely in keeping with that. And so we felt like there was a real opportunity to do something different. And when we did the research, what we found that was that we were already delivering this really high value service, you know, the consultancy and everything that we’ve just talked about. We were already delivering that. But we just weren’t attracting the customers that but we obviously we do have some fantastic customers too. But we in terms of new business, we weren’t attracting customers that really appreciated that. And so that was something that we wanted to grow moving forward. And so doing this rebrand and repositioning was all about becoming that premium brand that we weren’t selling out. tells us that we were delivering for our customers. And I guess in a way, we really wanted to reflect that kind of premium customer that we’re going after. And in what we were developing from a branding perspective, in that, you know, you, you will go to a specific shopping specific brand that you like, because you almost see you see yourself in that brand. And, and I know, certainly working in marketing, like, I will choose a brand based on how it looks like whether it feels like me or not, like, on the surface. So

Kyler Canastra 15:39
now, I guess like what other factors like you change the name of the company that I’m sure like the image and stuff like that, but what other things have you done to kind of present this image to the world in the way that you want?

Hayley Collingswood 15:50
Yeah, so obviously, rebranding, and the pandemic has been complicated, to say the least, and but I’d say what our focus has mainly been, has been about building up this brand profile. And sort of saying to the world, we’re different. And this is why and so I guess this all kind of fits into the entire positioning of the brand. So when we launched, we’re like, what we’re going to do, that’s gonna, you know, actually, our target right now is not necessarily to get tons of new customers, because that’s not the landscape we’re living in. So let’s build up this brand to be recognized as something that we’re different from where we were before. So for example, the podcast that we’ve just launched, Ventur Further. And it’s not a travel podcast, it’s not just talking about issues in travel, it’s about growth and mindset, and motivations and success. And we’re speaking to people from, yes, the world of sport in the world world of business, but also like, from all different areas like motivation, coaches, and things like that. So we’ve got some really big names on there. And it’s, it’s almost like this is just like having a bit of a chat with really interesting characters and saying, like, you know, we’re, we’re a travel partner, that actually offers you something extra,

Kyler Canastra 17:12
extra added value. That’s really cool. Yeah. Now, I was gonna mention that because you’re working in the podcast, which as I know, we’re on this podcast that I work on and a lot of work. So it kind of runs know, like, what your role in the podcast is, and how that experience has been so far. How do you find your guests? And I guess we already talked about them before, but kind of why is the show critical to Ventur? Yeah, so I’m very much in the coordination. I’m not the host, which is a lot of work. Yeah.

Hayley Collingswood 17:42
Yeah. So we have a fantastic host, Peter Wilcox, who actually is involved at Ventur and and has had his own podcast before. So he was the perfect candidate. So we just get in touch with whether it’s by our customers or with the connections, we have an industry. So again, that Ventur is about sort of building that network and like having a bit of a community around us. So that’s how we’re sourcing I guess, and then obviously, it’s just the production of it. As you well know, it takes a lot of time. And then getting out there promoting it. Obviously liaising with guests to kind of help amplify the message further as well. And and yeah, so it’s been a really interesting project. I’ve never worked on a podcast before. And it’s definitely first I suppose it’s very 2020.

Kyler Canastra 18:35
Very 2020. A lot of fun.

Hayley Collingswood 18:40
Yeah, is really, really fun. And engineer what we think such diversity is is such a fascinating project to work on. And so different sort of, I guess, the more typical marketing channels that and yeah, it’s been a pleasure to be part of it.

Kyler Canastra 18:56
It’s so cool. And how if people want to listen to the podcast, I think it launched this month, right, but there’s episodes available already. Yeah. Listen, where could we find it?

Hayley Collingswood 19:05
Yeah, so we’ve got it on the website,, or it’s also on Spotify, Google podcasts, Apple podcasts, or the usual

Kyler Canastra 19:15
I’m definitely gonna check it out before I wanted to before the interview, but you know, time got away. So I’m definitely because I’ve been trying to listen to more podcasts in general, this to get a better idea of what’s out there and kind of hear what other people do. So I’m definitely gonna tune in. And that’s really exciting, as well. And I like the idea of building community. I feel like that’s what we try to do as well. At The Content Mix. It’s not just about the podcast or marketing. It’s more about building a community, getting that network and just bringing people together, like I got a job through The Content Mix. Like that’s kind of three years ago, it changed my career and my life. So I think if we can bring more people together, it’s gonna get more opportunities for those that’s really nice to hear that not only is it about Ventur, but it’s about mind like you know, mindset and mindfulness and kind of how to be a better professional and better person, which I think it’s really cool. Now, from the background that you have video, for those who are watching the video, I think you’re home. So I kind of wanted to know more about like working in the pandemic, what has that meant for Ventur and what like your typical day for you like at work is like now

Hayley Collingswood 20:15
I say is in the pandemic, there is no typical day. Yeah, it seems to be changing. And definitely we’re seeing shifts, like I’ve talked a lot about how we’ve been very focused on the brand and sort of building that new positioning for ourselves. But actually, at the minute, we are now starting to see the shift the shift more into like, the tactical marketing was nine steepings comeback here in the UK, starting to see travel coming back with more competence in the industry. And things really started, people began. So obviously, that opens up a whole new world of opportunities for us. And compared to what we’ve had for the last 18 months, as far as travel has been one of the hardest hit areas. So it’s been a lot of lot of pivoting the word of the pandemic, like what’s going on? And but yeah, so we’re excited sort of get our teeth into it. And obviously, we’ve been very busy anyway, during all the all the ground work, which is actually nice to have a bit of bit of space bit of headspace to like focus on that and not also be to deliver like tons of day to day stuff alongside it. But yeah, I’ve been at home for the pandemic. And I think that’s something we’re gonna see more flexibility on. And in our workplace. I think it will vary from team to team for us and dependent on what people are looking for as well. And, but it’s certainly something that I’ve appreciated. And I think having more time, you know, personal time now I’ve got a dog, and I like to be able to walk myself now rather than having to pay someone to come in is really nice. So it makes a big difference. I think it’s not for everyone, but

Kyler Canastra 21:58
but it gives a good balance as well. Now and I have to ask, have you traveled in the pandemic? Just, you know, random question, but how is that experience?

Hayley Collingswood 22:06
Yeah, I have actually, we were fortunate enough to get away to Italy last year. And I’ve been away this year, but went to Italy last September, we went to Venice and a little country place just outside Verona. And I have to say what a perfect time to visit Venice. like nobody

Kyler Canastra 22:25
there. Nobody bad. Yeah. totally different experience. Yeah, normally it’s like, kind of not like I hate to say that. It’s like a theme park. But kind of it’s so many people you can’t even like experience the city.

Hayley Collingswood 22:39
Yeah, you can’t enjoy it. You saw it is all like narrow streets and stuff. So imagine you kind of just get like, been there pulled along by the people behind you. Yeah. And I know a few people that went to Rome as well as September and just said it was incredible. And I had a similar experience to you hadn’t been there when I went to Rome. Oh, can imagine it was absolutely amazing to get when it was a bit quiet. And, and obviously things were a bit strange last year, and you know, travels wasn’t right for everyone at that point in time. But for me, I just love to travel. And it’s a big part. Yeah, enjoyment. And I just go and I don’t know if you’re familiar with Cornwall, southwest of the UK. Yeah, we went there earlier in the year. And it rained.

Unknown Speaker 23:30
It rained the whole time.

Hayley Collingswood 23:33
So yeah, when you live in England, you’re quite keen to go somewhere without rain.

Kyler Canastra 23:38
Yeah, exactly. For sure. So it’s good to get to travel though. And and kind of these change of scenery, whether it’s Cornwall or Venice. So now I guess going back to marketing, I need to ask you a kind of devil’s advocate question about like, what do you think companies get wrong when it comes to marketing? Like someone with your experience, you kind of been in different organizations, what have you seen, it’s been like a red flag for you, or something that you think people could improve.

Hayley Collingswood 24:04
And I think it’s just being too safe and not challenging the status quo. To be honest, I think I have been very fortunate, but I always try and work for brands that are trying to do something different. And you know, want to say something about themselves. And I think a lot of brands particularly it tends to be the bigger brands, they tend to forget but they actually still need to fight for their market share and they actually need to mean something to their customers and they don’t sort of analyze that in a full when they when they do they sort of think oh but that would be risky or or you know, and then don’t have the courage to actually go ahead do something or try something and I suppose on the same line as that i think you know, sometimes you do need to fail like but if you try and fail you learn obviously not irreversible things. And but it is part of it, you know, especially in marketing, you don’t always know if something’s gonna work if it’s a completely new strategy that you’ve not tried before in that, you know, you go off on your gut, don’t you what you’ve seen work elsewhere. And then sometimes it works. And sometimes it doesn’t. But the important thing is that you learn and grow from that.

Kyler Canastra 25:22
Yeah, for sure. And it seems like I guess, like a thread or two thread for this conversation has been patience, like having patience and kind of letting things happen organically. And also just like taking a risk. But do you have any other skills that you think are important for marketers to have nowadays?

Hayley Collingswood 25:40
I think generally, just being able to, I guess, perception, I guess, being able to look at a situation, and not not just like, look at what you think it might be saying, but actually to take in all the information, and to really understand the various layers to that and use that to build a strategy moving forward. I think strategy in general, to be honest, gets left a lot. And sometimes it’s not helped by, you know, CEOs and boards, just saying, do this, do that do the other and people end up responding all the time. I think, actually being in a company and being in the position where marketing can define their own goals, their own strategy, their own objectives, is the way to create something that’s much stronger.

Kyler Canastra 26:32
Yeah, for sure. That’s great advice. Now, speaking of advice, I always say like on like the show, we have, you know, guests who are whether they’re just kind of like new to the industry, or very experienced, but we also our audience is kind of a big, you know, and I kind of want it that way I want people to, you know, listen, who are super experienced, but also people who are just starting out. And I think we were talking before about you graduating from university and kind of where your life is taking you. And I guess maybe, what would you tell to somebody now who’s just starting out? Or what would you tell Hayley, when she graduated from university like that you wish you kind of knew then that you know, now,

Hayley Collingswood 27:08
I think, I think it would be to find what you love. And I think, I don’t know, if it’s, it’s the same way you are. But over here, I so often see people recruiting for marketing managers, and they just do a bit of everything. And they just think, Well, no, like, it’s good to have passion, it’s good to have some thing and it doesn’t have to be a tiny little part of marketing. But you know, it’s good to have something that really inspires you want to be involved in obviously, for me, that’s branding and brand building, and, and that’s what I love. So I think in those early days, it’s like, get that exposure, like, you know, and then be confident enough to say, Actually, yes, I’m doing this at the minute, but I want to be over there doing that. I think that’s, that’s something that I’d say and also just to like value your own time, like don’t especially an agency, I think it can be really easy to, you know, get worked into the ground and feel like you’ve got to, to prove yourself. And one thing I’d say is, you don’t have to, and actually we work in the creative industry where, you know, we’re not going to be creative if we’re completely flat, and we’ve got no energy. And actually, we’re probably most creative, when we’re not working on anything. Do that for that project that was a lapse of taking that time away, I think is really

Kyler Canastra 28:31
important, like mental health and just taking a break. And also, it’s interesting what you started the first piece of advice because I, I think the episode that’s right before this one, we’re talking about the same thing about how we kind of grew up like we’re raised to be like, we have to be so multifaceted and do all these different things, and then not focus on one thing that could be our passion. So I think that’s very much like a really good piece of advice, because I think now I compared it to like YouTube influencers, like there’s so many of them now. And they try to do so many things. And it’s like, you know, you really, like stand out, and people are gonna want to watch you if you’re passionate about one specific thing, like that makes you happy. And you can share that with the world. And I think that’s so we can apply that to our jobs and marketing, for example. Yeah.

Hayley Collingswood 29:12
Sorry, just to like, you know, be able to recognize that, like, you know, I have an understanding of like, many areas of marketing, not all of them, but I, I won’t try and do them all, I’ll say, you know what, let’s get an expert into this. Let’s work with so and so. So to do that, because, you know, I think having respect for everyone, and that they’re sort of focuses in their career is important because it means they will do a much better job than you if it’s not really what you do.

Kyler Canastra 29:42
And it’s okay to say that you don’t know. So even if you’re like really far down in your career, like far along in your career, and you that’s an area that you have no idea a lot of people will be like, Oh, yeah, I know and lie and then it gets all you know, explodes and implodes on them. But it’s okay to say hey, I don’t know but I’m wanting to learn or I want to bring an expert. So we You can work together and I can learn from them. So yeah, that’s a really good piece of advice you’ve brought up. And like, I guess now we’re talking before about, like, how it’s important to step away from work and kind of so that you can get those creative juices flowing, but also for your mental health. And you also mentioned now that you work at home, you take the dog for a walk. So it’s kind of wondering kind of what other daily habits that you have that you would attribute to your success.

Hayley Collingswood 30:23
Yeah, I think just taking that time to get into a different headspace like, I really enjoy exercise. And I suppose not everyone does my, I find that quite relaxing in the same way. Sometimes it’ll be yoga, sometimes it will be, you know, going hell for leather on the spin class. And I think there’s all different things that you can do as a bit of a relief. And just to take your mind somewhere else for that half an hour, hour, or however long it is, and just enjoy it. And I think being able to take the dog for a walk and you know, on your lunch break and leave your work phone at home, I think is is good. Like, you know, there’s no point in going for a walk or walking around checking your emails the whole time and try bonds and stuff. Like I think when you taking that time, take it consciously, you know, work hard when you’re working. I find personally it’s not for everyone, but personally, I’m so productive, if I am fixed about when I’m working. And then when I take a break, I properly take a break. And I do find a more creative that way.

Kyler Canastra 31:29
So important. just disconnect some time soon. I actually really like exercise is a great way of like, it’s kind of like meditation in a way, like you’re not thinking about anything except what you’re doing and maybe how you’re dying in that spin class. But at least you’re not thinking about work and stresses from home, when all these different things that leads you to focus on one thing, you don’t realize it but like a good way to clear your mind, at least like to start the day I like to work out in the morning. So it’s good to stay that way. And I guess along the line, we’re talking about recommendations. And I want to know if you have any recommendations when it comes to like apps, or platforms, or tools or any books that anything that you think our audience could benefit from, whether it’s marketing or personal.

Hayley Collingswood 32:07
Yeah, I mean, yeah, just generally, like, I love listening to podcasts, actually, I think that’s kind of across different areas. And it just in terms of my personal life as well. Like, for example, I love food and cooking and nutrition and that kind of thing. So I love to do that. And I suppose more on the marketing front again, very, very 2020. But I’ve been really enjoying a lot of the webinars that I’ve been seeing, and McCann have had a great series and during the pandemic, the agency McCann called Creative Courage. And I’ve attended a couple of those went up unable to and they’ve been amazing. And I attended one that had the head of brand from Weetabix on. And he was talking about the power of Yes. And it was just really interesting to hear that kind of like, mindset perspective on how we work in marketing and about how to foster like, really strong creative ideas, actually, instead of saying, no, that’s not right. No, that’s not right. No, that’s not right. say, Okay, well, yeah, I see what you’re saying there. But how can we make it do this, this mess, and actually, that creates so much more opportunity, and in terms of leadership, as well, you know, and working with teams and things like that, as well. And actually, that’s what builds really strong creative, I suppose. We’ve talked a lot in this podcast about creative courage. And I just think McCann really nailed it though, that series. So yeah, that’s been great. And then also, books, marketing books, I tend to not love loads, because I find it quite cheesy. But there is one called Eating the Big Fish. And don’t get me wrong, it’s definitely cheesy. But if you can look past the cheese, I just think the ethos of the book is all about how in order to stand out and create a successful brand, you’ve got to be something you’ve got to do something and like if you think about I guess, like Virgin Atlantic, for example. And what Richard Branson did the airline decades and decades ago, to become the number one from having like one play that he was flying, you know, it, it really is that kind of mentality. And it’s not just about the underdog, either. This is what I sort of saying earlier about big brands getting lazy, like rain always need to be like an underdog all the time. Even if you are the market leader, otherwise, all of a sudden you won’t be like crap. So it’s interesting kind of book about how we also our brands have a place and there’s like certain personalities that kind of allow brands to succeed more than others

Kyler Canastra 34:59
as well. So I definitely need to check that book out. And I’ll make sure I get past that the cheesiness, it seems like it has really good value as well. But unfortunately, we’re getting to the end of our interview today, it’s been awesome to speak with you and to learn more about, like, What drives you and kind of your passion and kind of your career and how your career has been driven by that passion to help brands rebuild. So I really appreciate your time today. I’m sure our listeners will as well. But we had a lot of advice throughout the interview. But do you have any, like Final takeaways or parting advice that you’d like to leave for our audience?

Hayley Collingswood 35:33
And yeah, I think it’s just having courage generally, both in terms of what you want to do, and in terms of like, helping to create something that’s amazing. Like, if you want to be part of that important process, it’s important not to roll over and I think that will set you up in good stead for the rest of your career. Really.

Kyler Canastra 35:52
Yeah. Wow. Those are Words To Live By. So also, if people wanted to, like follow you, or like get in touch some way, is LinkedIn the best way I don’t know if you have any other platforms or channels.

Hayley Collingswood 36:03
Yeah, LinkedIn is the best way just Hayley Collingswood. I’m one and only something.

Kyler Canastra 36:09
That’s good. I’m one of only two. Okay, so we don’t have it. That’s nice. It’s really easy. Yeah, I want to thank you again, Haley, so much for coming on the show today and sharing your insights. And I want to also thank everyone for listening in today. And as always, for more perspectives on content marketing industry in Europe for marketing in general and Europe, check out very content comm slash mix and keep tuning into the podcast for more interviews with content experts. So we’ll see you next time. Thanks, Haley. Thank you

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