Here is a transcript generated by Otter.ai of The Content Mix podcast interview with VeraContent’s Kyler Canastra and Annika Engelbrecht, chocolate marketing expert:

Kyler Canastra 0:02
Hi everyone, I’m Kyler from The Content Mix. And I’m excited to be here with Annika Engelbrecht a global marketing director with vast experience in the food and beverage industry in both Europe and Asia. Now we all love chocolate. Annika knows all about this product as a multilingual leader with over 14 years of international marketing experience and a proven track record of extraordinary results. And because positive attitude and open mindset are two characteristics, which have allowed her to motivate teams and promote mutual trust amongst them. What’s more, Annika has helped brands reposition themselves through content marketing and a successful implementation of marketing strategies. And we’re excited to hear more about her work and gain firsthand insight from this marketing expert. So we’re gonna dive right in and learn more from her. So Annika, thanks so much for joining us today on the content mix.

Annika Engelbrecht 0:51
Well, thank you for having me, Tyler.

Kyler Canastra 0:53
It’s our pleasure. So I just gave you a nice little introduction that I did based on my research about you in the conversations that we had before leading up to interview but I’d love to hear more about yourself. And if you can introduce yourself in your own words. So tell us a bit more about where you’re from. And what’s your, your relation to Content Marketing Europe?

Annika Engelbrecht 1:10
Absolutely. Well, as you can hear from my lovely accent, I’m actually German. I’m German, but I’ve been living in Italy for the last 11 years. So basically, I feel more Italian than German nowadays. And I came into marketing in the late 2006. So it’s been quite a long time, more than 14 years 15 Or so it’s really been a long experience. And that’s how I got into contact with content marketing, because people really let’s face it don’t want to just buy a product anymore. They really want to be pursued and enticed.

Kyler Canastra 1:44
Did you’re like marketing career start in Germany? Or did it start in Italy,

Annika Engelbrecht 1:48
it started in Germany. Basically, I got into marketing when I was working well, when I was studying and I became a working student in oh two Germany. In my university studies, I focused on economics, and basically always said that marketing was for girls. So I specialized in financing and banking. Given that I needed money, I started working in Germany and the market in the CRM and, and that’s when I started to fall in love with marketing, because it was highly digital, super immediate, and, and really, really exciting. So great grades, really a great content of work and of life.

Kyler Canastra 2:29
Fantastic. Now I have to ask, I’m sure people are gonna listen, like one know, a German living in German, we know have the stereotype and I don’t like stereotypes. But I know Germans can be very efficient and precise, while Italians, maybe not so much. So just wondering how was that like, shift for you moving into the Italian workplace?

Annika Engelbrecht 2:48
Oh, let’s face it. So I worked. I went here in I came here in 2010. And, well, I consider myself or at least I was very typically German, I think I was very precise. I was and I still am very punctual. And I’m very organized. My partner will tell you about this, for him a pain in the neck, but it has its advantages as well, as well. And so in coming to Italy, basically my first thing that I had to learn was that there is a diplomacy here in Italy, which is you don’t say immediately what you’re seeing, but you need to little bit talk around it. So you would never say we have bad weather. You say? Well, the limit of cloud, it’s not so nice, you know, you would explain it in a lot of words. That’s my main point that I took away from from coming to Italy, be more department diplomatic. And, and yes, don’t be too direct, you know. So try to be a bit nicer and a bit more flexible and things you know. Yeah. As Germans, we are not always so not known for that.

Kyler Canastra 3:54
Yeah. So I think it’s important to make, like make it clear that I’m not saying one’s better the other but it’s just you know, as both of us have lived in different countries from where we’re originally born, it’s more of an adaptation that really helps. And we’ll talk about that more in interview, which is how like, leading an international workplace how important intercultural communication and understanding is in order to be able to achieve goals together. Now, when we’re looking at your experience, I just saw chocolate everywhere. And I saw your names like Lindt, which is something that’s like a very big brand in the US, but also here in Europe. And chocolate basically has played a really integral role in your marketing career, including Yeah, previous experience at Lindt and Sprungli. So how did you get involved in the world of chocolate? Do you like chocolate? I’m assuming you do. But what makes this area two I wanted to know kind of food and beverage is a big sector and it’s fun to know what makes this area distinct in comparison to others.

Annika Engelbrecht 4:43
Okay, so Well, chocolate, I think everybody loves chocolate. Only the people that maybe has lost a tooth or something that will not love chocolate, but chocolate is a highly emotional, very positively charged element. Basically, so it’s something I’ve always loved as a consumer, so it’s clear. And I came into this world of chocolate baking. Also after my university studies in 2007. When my dad told me Oh, look, there’s a high potential program of Lindt & Sprüngli, why don’t you apply that? So I applied, it was more faithful to my dad than to myself back then. But during his husband center, I’ve learned so much about chocolate about lint. And I immediately start to like, as I spent the 13 years and Lindt then one year with Pernigotti, a different Italian chocolate brand. And I must say, especially in my 13 years, with Linde I fell in love with brand. And I really got so passionate about what I was doing that, yes, it was work. But still, there was such a huge passionate factor that it didn’t really feel like work. And so what makes it different from other categories is really, I think, the emotional factor. So it’s very positive, everybody has great memories of chocolate. It has it at the same time, there’s negative connection that people think about that way about how they want to nurture themselves in a more healthy way. And so, so that’s probably, you know, this dichotomy that you always want to overcome when you do marketing for chocolate. That, yeah, it’s interesting, you know, you want to leverage the positive feelings. And at the same time, we need to make people forget that there’s also the guilt.

Kyler Canastra 6:27
Exactly. Now, it’s interesting, too, we’re talking about like, a lot of different cultural differences. And I feel like one thing that has, it’s always the same is it’s like people’s passion for chocolate doesn’t matter where you go in the world, at least I don’t know, maybe someone can correct me if they’re listening. But like, everywhere, there’s chocolate and every like different country or region, the world has their own, like take on chocolate. And it’s just this passion. And I think that’s what you just mentioned before, you’re alluding to this idea of an emotional charge. Now, this is something that’s really important when it comes to content marketing, in terms of storytelling. So I want to know a bit more about like how the storytelling play in the world of chocolate? And why is it important for consumers to understand the tradition and history of a chocolate brand? I feel like every chocolate brand has a history. I remember, like I went I think it wasn’t Italy, Persia, maybe they had like a chocolate festival or something. I remember being like, you know, mesmerized by all the history and like the tradition that went into that festival. So that’s kind of why I came up with that question. But I wanted to know a bit more about how to storytelling play and to like the overall picture of the chocolate industry.

Annika Engelbrecht 7:27
Well, I mean, story. Chocolate itself has a great story to tell, you know, you can really be emotional about your story that you’re telling. And in the end, as humans, we love stories. We want to listen to stories, they are ubiquitous, they are timeless, we remember some great stories for life. Whatever they told me when I was little girl, I still remember that today. So if you find the right point, the passion point, in this case and not pain point, then you can really leverage on that and make it emotional. And that basically is what chocolate helps you to do, to really charge the product with positive emotions. So I think when it comes to storytelling in chocolate, you really want to, of course, have a clear objective in what you want to tell, know the passion points of your consumers, and then really build with the right attributes on these passion points. And then you have a relevant story and stand out.

Kyler Canastra 8:25
So now, how do you tie this with marketing? And like the campaigns and strategies that you’ve worked on? How do you include that storytelling aspect?

Annika Engelbrecht 8:33
Well, usually, well, I mean, when you create your pack, your marketing plan, and then you always have your plan your communication objective and basically knit not connected to this communication objective here, you basically create your your storytelling, sometimes it can be a standalone companion or a standalone message. And sometimes you have more bits and pieces like chocolate recipes for for the people that wanted those that want to cook, or just your Instagram stories that are based on a basic Instagram Stories, Instagram posts that are based on stories. So it depends, you know, in this case, it depends. But overall, it always has to it has to build on the overall objective.

Kyler Canastra 9:16
Now a question that just came to mind too, is that I feel like when people think about chocolate, they’re very much like if you think about different audiences, they’re very much tied to certain brands, I feel like, you know, you grew up with a certain brand. And then for example, in the US, like Hershey is kind of like the name that we all have, even though I’m not the biggest. There’s much better chocolate out there. But I do I mean, Hershey is very important. It’s kind of part of our identity. So and from a marketing point of view, like if you want to capture the attention of someone that is like that, let’s say like me, for example, that is Hershey is the number one and that’s part of like the American identity. How do you kind of break that? I don’t know break through that wall, I guess because it’s kind of like some people are just really true. It looks really dedicated to one brand and kind of used to that storytelling. That’s all they want. So from, I don’t know, with so many different chocolate brands around, how do you make yours like stand out from the rest?

Annika Engelbrecht 10:07
Well, I think you need it with anything be distinctive and have something that is credible, you know, I mean, if you have a great product that is really has distinctive assets, then you have to leverage on them. If you think about lindora, which is the number one brand, and then you have the ball with a cracking shell, and then the smooth melting center, so the resistible Lindores, smoothness, of course, there are people who don’t like it. But normally when you make them taste it, people get the idea, and they understand what makes it so special. I would always try to build on this irresistible smoothness in my communication and above the line and then make people try it at least once if it’s possible. And this way, normally, you convince people of your better product.

Kyler Canastra 10:53
And I think like from my perspective, too, and that’s kind of like a random anecdote, but I feel like Lindt has become really popular because of the free samples in the US like that’s a big thing, like you always got the link start get a free sample. And I feel like that’s what you said, as soon as people try it, then it’s so true. Like, once you try it, then everyone loves it. And it’s, that’s a really good marketing, like, I don’t know, thing that they did, because it really helps get the name around. Not everyone knows that I think when I was growing up, it wasn’t as common, but maybe like 10 Couple years ago, that’s what’s like the free samples, like get a free sample and try it. And then you get to always buy more, you can never leave empty handed.

Annika Engelbrecht 11:28
That’s not really the case. Now we’re going to talk

Kyler Canastra 11:30
a bit more about kind of the repositioning where he did for brand and what you think like a chocolate brand can like benefit from in terms of content marketing, but I did as I mentioned, introduction, you are a multilingual marketer, who enjoys working international environments. I’m really fascinated by this as well, because it involves a lot of elements, intercultural communication and kind of how do you motivate a team that has all different backgrounds and like we were talking about before, different perspectives on life, because of where they grew up. So your experience has brought you to many parts of Europe, including Spain, where I previously lived, where you were the marketing director of Iberia, for linens from Italy. So how is your so I guess I’m assuming as well that you have interest in languages as well, because you speak wonderful English, you’re German speak German, Italian, I’m assuming you speak Spanish as well. So how does your interest in languages help you navigate international working environments and facilitate cross team and cross cultural communication?

Annika Engelbrecht 12:22
Well, I mean, you will have the same experience with your Spanish probably, once you learn the foreign language, you have like a key to a door that really was unlocked before. And I think language helps you understand all the, you know, the small parts, the small differences in humor in motivations. And I mean, in the end, if you are in an open office, and you can hear all the conversations, and you can understand all the conversations, you can feel the tension or the happiness, or you can feel everything that is going around you even better than when you speak in English with with a Spanish person. I think that’s the number one key. And secondly, I think that people open up in a different way when they can express themselves in their personal language. So Italians, I mean, an average, they’re not the best at Italian English. So if you speak Italian, you will come to them, and you will be closer to them in such a different way. So

Kyler Canastra 13:17
I think it’s so true. And I think like we’re talking before you asked me why I moved to Spain and all this stuff. And I told you, I studied linguistics, and I think, obviously learning a language, it opens a lot of doors, and it helps you communicate with people. But then I think when I took that deep dive into we had to do like prac pragmatics was like a big area about and learning how different cultures how like, for example, in Spain, I always thought like, it was very rude that people would inter like, interrupt you in a conversation. But I actually learned by doing this course and all that that’s actually a sign of interest. Like, the more they interrupt you, it’s actually a sign of like, Oh, I’m actually interested in what you’re saying. And I always thought it was rude or I always thought like, my Spanish wasn’t good. I can’t keep up while like because in English, we always wait our turn are very, like polite in that sense. So I think that has really helped me when it kind of I feel like a lot of people were like, you studied linguistics, and now you like working in international, like business environment is it really helps because I actually am able to understand, kind of, I can see I feel like I’ve opened my mind a bit more rather than saying like, you know, having that tunnel vision in terms of like, oh, yeah, this is the way I do and that’s it. It really learning languages not only helps you communicate, but I think like you said is like the key to open so many doors in terms of like, how to understand how other people think and understand things.

Annika Engelbrecht 14:27
And you know, the funny thing probably, maybe that happens to you as well. I feel different when I speak a different language. So I’m different in German than I am from when I speak Italian or when I speak Spanish or English.

Kyler Canastra 14:40
Yeah, you kind of create this person out and definitely more direct in Spanish than I would be in English. I feel like in English I’m a bit more and in Spanish I feel I don’t know I mean more confident to do so or that’s just kind of survival of the fittest. I guess you have to be directed to the point because that’s how Spanish people are. So I feel like I’m still learning my Portuguese side by side Do you feel like the cultural apart from my upbringing, I feel a bit more I feel very comfortable here. So we’ll see when my personality comes, as I learned this third language now, I wanted to talk to you about, we were saying before the repositioning work you’ve done so you and your career have helped, you know, chocolate brands who position themselves using marketing strategies. And we were just talking before about how, you know, it’s really important for a chocolate brand to be distinct and to be different and to stand out. So in your opinion, like what kind of content is essential for a brand when they want to reposition themselves, especially a chocolate brand?

Annika Engelbrecht 15:33
Well, I think it depends a little bit how far you going from the original brands. So if you have an established traditional chocolate brand, like the one that I’ve worked for, then I would definitely try to emphasize whatever is new to you in terms of attributes to the old brand positioning. I think whatever helps you to underline what makes your brand special and distinctive in a relevant way, will definitely help you to bring the brand across and bring it across also why Why should buy it, you know, the for the existing consumers and also for the new ones.

Kyler Canastra 16:07
And also curious to in terms of because you said you started your career in 2006. And I feel like from 2006 Till now, in terms of content marketing and social media, it’s a whole new ballgame, right? So it’s like, how do you think like brands are adapting essentially, like chocolate brands are adapting to like Instagram and all these different platforms and channels that we have now?

Annika Engelbrecht 16:28
Well, I think in generally speaking, I think CPG is still a little bit behind, I think other areas that are stronger, I mean, CPG in terms of food, maybe beverages a little bit better in terms of content marketing, I think, well, when I remember my first content that I created, I was so proud, and you know, and in the end we are we are talking about maybe a Facebook posts or something. And that was a major thing back then. So I’m really getting old. Now. I think that the strongest brands are really finding their niche, you know, I mean, there’s brands in Holland, that’s called Tony, Chuck lonely. They’re building everything on having a fair, sustainable chocolate. So they don’t use child labor, they want to have it look fairly sourced. And they have found their way of positioning that is unique and still relevant for some people. I mean, I honestly have bought them ever, but I also live in the Netherlands. But I think the positioning was great and interesting. So I think it really depends on which kind of positioning you want to have in order to have your niche or your piece of the pie.

Kyler Canastra 17:37
Now, besides that brand that you’re just mentioning, is there any other example of a campaign or a piece of content that you’ve recently seen maybe on social media or different channels that has stood out to you kind of like, wow, that’s innovative?

Annika Engelbrecht 17:48
Yeah, well, innovative. I think that people who do really well, such as Nike, for instance, I mean, they have their app that is really free. And you can you can use it in order to basically define your training moments, how and when you want to train, and it’s really basically fit on your training needs. So I think Nike does a great job. There’s another app Well, application, it’s not an application, it’s both an application and a website, makeup.com which is bye bye L’Oreal. Now, I’m not really the biggest fan of makeup myself, but I see the tutorials. And I find it really nicely done and very relevant without having the brand in your face. And I think this is the common thing between the two, you don’t have the brands continuously in your face as a marketing and advertising message. But it’s something that is giving me an added value. And that goes from storytelling to really involving the consumer in in the brand. So in the content

Kyler Canastra 18:46
itself. Yeah. So now talking about that I need to ask you about what do you think about influencer marketing? Because that’s what that is influencer marketing. It’s kind of a whole new approach to make the whole selling experience right or buying experience more personal. So what’s your opinion on that?

Annika Engelbrecht 19:02
Well, I think influence of marketing depends on the influencer. And it depends on Well, whom you connect to your product. Because there are big influences, you know, that just changed the product every day. I don’t know, the Kardashians go with the Kardashians, for instance, because they advertise so many things that probably you know, my product will just be one of the many. So probably nowadays, I would rather go with somebody smaller and then do seeding, even though it’s a little bit difficult to to be handled because it’s more work. Yeah. It really depends. I mean, if you have a great cook, who’s very well known and I can associate my brand with this cook and I’m sure that he doesn’t use anybody else. Why not? But it’s not the normal case. That’s

Kyler Canastra 19:47
the biggest problem now is that there’s so many different people to be three different things there’s no more like it’s hard to find your niche for sure. Whether you’re the influencer or the person trying to use an influencer for marketing. Now I didn’t like I didn’t mention this in the intro, but you’re currently helping the vadais a basketball team with their marketing strategy, which is really cool and very different from your experience in chocolate when we’re just talking about up until now. So what types of consultation work are you doing for them? And kind of how did you get that job? How did you find this team that needed help,

Annika Engelbrecht 20:19
I live close to my razor. So the connection was rather easy. I know some people who are working there. So it was basically because of connections, personal connections, which is very common in Italy again. Now, it’s basically a job where I’m working together with marketing team that they have, they have very good marketing team, great people that are really fun to work with. And my goal is basically to help them reposition the brand and build the marketing plan together with them for the existing the existing team, and then also for the juvenile team for the mini basket. And so far. So a different view on marketing, really, because it’s really short term, you know, it’s not like in CPG, where you think about your marketing plan will be one and a half years or two years in advance. But really, okay, so we do this now, next week, or in two weeks, you start implementing and that’s about it.

Kyler Canastra 21:15
Do you like do you like basketball?

Annika Engelbrecht 21:19
I followed, I followed the NBA when I was little. And then honestly, I forgot a little bit about it. But it’s a great spot. It’s really, I really prefer to go to soccer or to any other sport. And yeah, it’s really fascinating, you know, and it’s fascinating to understand the logic behind it, and what makes you a fan and what doesn’t. And sorry, and to have a plan that builds marketing around the club, independently from from the result of the game itself. Really, what some what counts in marketing this case?

Kyler Canastra 21:52
Yeah, it must be like comparing yourself to like bigger teams, right? If you had like a big, you know, famous soccer team or a basketball team, like they’re always gonna have dedicated fans, but it can be hard if you have a smaller team, and they’re not winning, for example, how do you build a marketing campaign that really gives them a spotlight? You know?

Annika Engelbrecht 22:09
Now we’re working on that current

Kyler Canastra 22:12
challenge.

Annika Engelbrecht 22:13
Yeah, definitely. But I mean, of course, you look at the biggest teams possible. So you went to serene, for instance, is one great example for marketing. And the NBA, of course, I mean, you as an American, you will know better than me. I mean, the Chicago Bulls back at the time when I was little, were great. And everything that they did was just fantastic marketing as well. So definitely examples to follow.

Kyler Canastra 22:35
Yes. And I have to give a little shout out to Massachusetts, where I’m from Fetzer, basketball was invented. So there you go, Hall of Fame is really cool to hear every chance to go to Springfield, Massachusetts, it’s really interesting. But if you’re a fan of basketball, but it also tells you the history and kind of the marketing that goes into it, and kind of how it turned into this huge empire around the world, which is really interesting. Now, so I kind of want to ask you more general questions in terms of just like, from your experience, like, what do you think so like, what do you think companies get wrong? When it comes to content marketing, from what you’ve seen? And from the work you’ve done?

Annika Engelbrecht 23:09
Well, let’s face it, we are all not perfect. I’ve also done my mistake. So I’m speaking now as an independent one. And I think generally speaking, the biggest mistake people do is not to have the objectives, right. So they don’t have clear objectives. And this meaning leads to the fact that you probably don’t even have the right insights on which you base your communication. And then maybe your communication is even not relevant. So that these are the major three, I would say, and basically, in the end people risk to speak about themselves instead of sort of their brand and how great they are, instead of making it relevant for the consumer and involving them. You know,

Kyler Canastra 23:49
yeah, that’s the thing too, it’s important what you just said about, like, you’ve made mistakes, too. And I think a lot of times, we put pressure on ourselves to be perfect, and you know, think everything’s gonna go to plan. And I think, maybe now after a pandemic, we realize, you know, we can never, you know, predict the future expect what’s going to happen. So I think it’s so important to hear that too, that like, we can’t be perfect, and marketing is never going to be perfect. It’s more about just understanding your target audience and trying to get into their shoes and understand what they want.

Annika Engelbrecht 24:16
I’m sure now in the end, taking the example of basketball, it’s not the the the objective is not to be perfect. The objective is to win the game and to be better than the other.

Kyler Canastra 24:26
Exactly. She’s gonna try to win the game and you roll fall, but you have to get back up for sure. And now, I also want to ask you to kind of pretend that you’re starting. You have no marketing experience, and you’re starting your career today. What advice would you give yourself starting out today?

Annika Engelbrecht 24:42
Be curious, be curious. That would be number one. Try to find out everything. Ask lots of questions. Ask why and try to stay with the other people around you as much as possible. Everybody’s a teacher, and you can learn from everyone. So that’s my main advice. And then, learn the basics. Be humble and learn the basics. Because if you don’t know how to interpret data, it will bring you nowhere nowadays.

Kyler Canastra 25:09
Yes, yeah, true. And I guess whatever recent episode, they got that. So they, I guess mentioned was just saying, you know, you can be the number one person in your company are like an expert in marketing, but you always have to, like, learn from the people that you work with. If they’re, if they’re below you, or above you, or, you know, beside you. It’s always good to like, stay curious, but also stay humble. So I think that’s a really I’ve heard that from a lot, I guess. So I think it’s so true. And I think it’s really good when it comes to marketing too, because we have to be continuously learning because especially digital marketing, everything’s changing so quickly, nowadays is that you have to kind of stay above you know, or ahead of the rest and kind of keep learning and although you might think Tik Tok, for example, is crazy and what’s going on, and people are dancing in the streets and doing all these things. It is important when it comes to marketing. So just kind of having an open mind as well. I think it’s super important. Now, my favorite part of the interviews is always the recommendations part. And I’m sure people that listen to this podcast probably hate me for saying that so many times. But I do love recommendation, I love learning from different people what they do, or what they’ve used, or who they expect, like and are inspired by. So do you have any daily habits that you attribute to your success that you could share with us?

Annika Engelbrecht 26:19
Well, I think, you know, the, the most important habit that I have is to try it to sleep enough to eat well and work out. Having having a fit body, I think is one of the basics in order to be successful in whatever you do. And the second one is I read a lot. So I read newspapers on a daily basis, I try to look into LinkedIn to Instagram to podcasts. So whatever type of content in this case I can consume, that might be relevant for me is is definitely something I would recommend all those who do to others.

Kyler Canastra 26:51
Yeah, it’s fine. Um, and do you have like a, like, everyone’s like, wow, this is a weird question like dev professional role model. But do you have a fresh aroma or sorcery inspiration?

Annika Engelbrecht 27:01
Well, I don’t have one person. You know, it’s, there are many people who are really interesting in this planet. And so I try to really follow them. And yeah, read the books, listen to their stories. And yeah, follow their podcasts or anything else. The following just one person that’s too limiting, because there’s too much out there.

Kyler Canastra 27:21
Yeah, exactly. And he mentioned to you before, that you consume a lot of content and try to you know, like, get everything that you can and learn all the time. Now, do you have any recommendations when it comes to like books or tools or, you know, podcasts that you would recommend for our listeners.

Annika Engelbrecht 27:36
And I must say that, now recently, I’ve, we I’ve read lots of Simon Sinek. So start with why is one of the best books I’ve ever read. But he’s written others. He also has a great podcast, that’s called a bit of optimism, which really is all about that. So it’s, it’s really charging me always been lots of energy. So it’s a great one. And given that I love books, I can give you two more one more marketing, which is digital driving digital strategies. And an author is Sunil Gupta is a professor in in Harvard, right. But really, very interesting book, and very inspiring. And the third one is, and this was for me inspiring in terms of creativity. It’s called Creativity, Inc. and it was written by Ed Catmull, the CEO and the founder of Pixar. So it’s really a cool book. And yeah, definitely one of the best reads that I’ve had in the recent past.

Kyler Canastra 28:35
Fantastic. Now we’re coming to the end of our interview, unfortunately, because it’s been great to learn from you. And to hear about your experience, I feel like we have a lot in common when it comes to, you know, living in different countries and working international places, and also just a passion for marketing and for content itself. But do you have any final takeaways for our audience? Anything that you want someone that’s listening to this, you know, really hold on to?

Annika Engelbrecht 28:58
Well, you know, I recently heard something that really changed my life. It’s something that doesn’t have anything to do with marketing itself. By Marshall Goldsmith, the coach from from America, he’s really one of the role models, I’d say that one could follow, but not just the one. And he basically said, we have our life in our own hands, we can build whatever we want to build. And so instead of asking yourself, Am I happy? Ask yourself, did I do my best to be happy today? And so this really, I mean, I was always stuck in the first phrase, and this changed my entire way of thinking about like, this is what I would give as last

Kyler Canastra 29:41
for it. It’s important to always remember that you’re the change starts with you, and happiness starts with you. So you have to be the one that does that. So whether you’re not happy or not, it’s not from the environment, it’s from you. Exactly. Use that and create the life that you want to live. Now, before we conclude, I have to ask so we got an touch with you on LinkedIn. Is that the best way to get in touch with you if anyone else wants to, you know, follow you or anything like that? Are you active and other platforms?

Annika Engelbrecht 30:08
I’m mostly active on LinkedIn. Let’s face it, life is so little time. So I think that is definitely the best,

Kyler Canastra 30:14
but it’s perfect. And I have one final question that I have to ask dark chocolate, white chocolate or milk chocolate.

Annika Engelbrecht 30:23
It depends mostly with nuts. And if it’s milk or white, then I prefer it. But also great dark chocolate. It’s too too high too.

Kyler Canastra 30:32
So yeah, is it bias? Oh, yeah. I love dark chocolate. So good.

Annika Engelbrecht 30:38
Very good. Excellent. seasalt. Try

Kyler Canastra 30:40
this my favorite. Okay, great. So we are perfectly aligned on that. Thank you so, so much, Annika for sharing your insights with us today. And thanks, everyone for listening. And as always, for more perspectives on the content marketing industry in Europe, check out veracontent.com/mix And keep tuning into the podcast for more interviews with content experts like Annika. We’ll see you all next time. Thank you so much. Thank you

Transcribed by https://otter.ai