Here is a transcript generated by otter.ai of The Content Mix podcast interview with Payam Edelat, global communications social media producer at Philip Morris International:

Carlota Pico 0:13
Hi everyone, and welcome back to The Content Mix. I’m Carlota Pico, your host for today’s show and I’m excited to introduce Payam Edelat, global communications social media producer at Philip Morris International and has over nine years of experience in marketing and communications. Welcome, Payam, and thank you so much for joining us today on The Content Mix.

Payam Edelat 0:32
Thank you so much for having me. I’m really excited to talk to you.

Carlota Pico 0:35
I’m excited as well. Let’s dive straight into the interview, then. Payam, could you tell me a little bit about your background and how you got into your current role?

Payam Edelat 0:45
Yeah, of course. It’s a bit of a different one, actually, because I went into industry before I did my degree. So I started my career in journalism actually in 2011. Well, nine years ago—strange thinking that that was nine years ago now, but yes, I was fresh out of sixth form, having completed my A Levels, so that’s college level education at that point. And I applied for an 11 month internship at Sky, which is a broadcaster in the UK and, and outside of actually in Europe as well. It was a great scheme, you were either placed with the entertainment team, production, graphics, sports, or news and as you know, it’s a hugely popular program, I was lucky enough to get the position at Sky News. And then, I was there for a year where I spent time with correspondence, with cameraman, news desks, but ultimately it was the digital team where I spent most of my internship and that paved the way to where I am today, because back then social media didn’t really—it hadn’t really…I don’t want to say it didn’t exist, but it hadn’t really taken off for large companies and news organizations. So Sky News, for instance, had a Facebook page and a Twitter page with very few followers. And that’s all it was, which is, you know, completely different to today where I think they’re past 10 million followers across across platforms. So yeah, that’s kind of where I started. And I worked through the different departments there, and then went on to do my degree, having been there for a year, and then throughout my degree, which I did in journalism, I worked at Sky sort of part time. So I was there on evenings, weekends, holidays, which is a really cool job to actually have, you know, compared to my friends who were working in bars or retail and that sort of thing. So I was very, very fortunate in that in that way.

Carlota Pico 2:47
Okay, excellent. Well, your background is similar to mine as well, because I’m actually a journalist by education. And I started off in communication and print PR. I was doing PR campaigns for emerging markets that were distributed through mainstream media channels, but print media channels. And now obviously, I’m in the digital world of marketing. So I’m going to zoom into that a little bit. So going from Sky News to a leading tobacco company, what’s your day to day like now?

Payam Edelat 3:17
Yeah, so our day to day is sort of made up of reactive and proactive tasks. So we start off our day with morning meeting and newsjacking. So this is where we look through all the PMI related and industry related news coverage from the previous 24 hours. And then we discuss whether there are any that we want to sort of look into any more detail or amplify. So that’s very much reactive. And then the rest of the day, we work very much like a newsroom, which is handy. We’re coming up with messaging and writing… messaging work with designers on creative campaigns to tell the PMI story but we’re also very much poised to spring into reactive mode when the need arises when news comes up that’s PMI related and we need to react.

Carlota Pico 4:09
Okay, very interesting. So then, let’s say that all of a sudden you were promoted—which I’m sure you will be promoted at some point—and you’re tasked with finding a new candidate for your role. What type of qualities and skills would you look for in that new candidate?

Payam Edelat 4:30
That’s a…that’s a good one. First of all, do you know something that I don’t know? Because if you do, let me know so I can some shopping. It’ll be great.

Carlota Pico 4:38
You might be interviewing me, actually, who knows!

Payam Edelat 4:41
Come along, come along.

But skills needed for this type of job. I think it’s really important to have experience outside of marketing, and to have experience outside of social media. So you’re bringing something to the table that you know someone else in your position might not be bringing. So yeah, anything else, it doesn’t even need to be news or print or broadcast or anything. It could be anything to do with science, that would be super useful. It could be to do with law, again, really useful. Anything that you bring to the table, I think in any job, that’s different to that role you’re going to be really handy. The other thing that’s important is accuracy. Accuracy is hugely important for not just working in a…you know, obviously, working anywhere accuracy is important…but when you work for a tobacco company, everything that you do is is scrutinized and rightly so it should be. So, you know, every post, every tweet, every message that goes out is looked at and has the potential to have wider business ramifications. So accuracy is hugely important. Anything that you say you’ve got to make sure that you’ve cross checked with legal representatives and with science and making sure that what you’re saying is is truthful, really. So yeah, those—accuracy and bringing something new to the table. That’s that’s really the key to this role.

Carlota Pico 6:06
Okay. And I’m sure, having worked for Sky News definitely came in handy when it comes to accuracy because the news is all about that right? To not have an opinion and deliver the news straight forward as it is.

Payam Edelat 6:18
Yeah. Yeah. So as you say, accuracy, it really—a newsroom really enforces that, yeah. It’s just as important, if not more so when you’re working for a multinational company, especially when it’s tobacco. But also, aside from that, the newsroom prepared me for a few things. If you think about journalism, what is it? It’s storytelling at the end of it, and that’s all there is to it. And actually working on television output taught me the number one rule of storytelling and that’s to put people at the heart of everything that you do. Because that’s what essentially we all engage with. And, you know, if you think about where I was before, you know, everyday you’re writing news and you’re writing stories about people—the PMI story is very similar. There are a billion—more than a billion smokers in the world, this company, which has been the biggest tobacco company in the world, for many years now, is going through what I believe would be a historic transformation. It’s transitioning away from cigarettes towards alternatives that are better for those people who don’t quit. So that’s, you know, there is an opportunity there to make a huge difference to public health. And I’m quite excited to play that play a role in telling that story as small as that role may be.

Carlota Pico 7:34
Okay, I do want to pick your brain a little bit. What was it like, from a newsroom to the corporate world and also like, not only the corporate world, but a leading tobacco company?

Payam Edelat 7:46
Yeah, it was a…it was a lot to swallow. At first it was very difficult for me to leave Sky News. I was there from such a young age. I think I was about 17 when I started there. There was a joke circulating saying that I was born in one of the edit suites, which obviously isn’t true. But, you know, I was there for a really long time, so it was really difficult to leave there, working with really amazing people. And when you work in a news organization, you’re constantly being hounded by PR people, you’re being sent stories, and it becomes tiring. So now I’m on the other side—I’ve become that person who is constantly hounding news organizations, talking to them. So that was quite tricky to deal with, becoming the person on the other side of the table. And also, when you work in journalism, you’re someone who is quite used to asking questions, asking difficult questions. And tobacco company has a very checkered past, obviously, they’ve been producing a product that is detrimental to people’s health. The company accepts that and they’re trying to move away from it, so that’s what really drew me to it. I understand you know, everyone’s going to be skeptical when they hear that the world’s biggest factor company is trying to move away from cigarettes. And it’s a difficult thing to deal with when you’ve, you know, a lot of people that I’ve met working in the company have family members whose lives have been changed because of, you know, addiction to cigarettes. But I do think that there’s—and this is what really helped me make that transition—is I do believe that if the company is genuine about this, there is a huge opportunity to make a difference to the health of millions of people around the world.

Carlota Pico 10:38
Now, there’s a lot of noise out there. So I want to focus on social networks, which is your area of strength and also your, part of your current role right now. So what are some tactics that you use to attract the right type of attention to your brand, considering that there is so much noise right now across different social media channels worldwide, especially during Corona times? I mean, all of us have just taken to our social channels to voice our opinions, to market our brands. But that doesn’t necessarily mean that we’re being read by anybody. So…

Payam Edelat 13:52
It is, it is strange, because social media is something where you don’t get immediate feedback. I mean, you do get sort of likes and shares, and that sort of thing, but you’re not really, unless someone is commenting, you’re not getting immediate feedback, whereas you would with other industries. So it’s a case of making sure that you’re up to date with everything that’s going on with social. The media landscape, the social media landscape is constantly evolving. And it’s still so new. There are platforms that keep popping up. And there are existing platforms that keep changing their functionality. So it’s mainly a case of making sure you’re up to date with those, taking advantage of all of the new functionality that these various social media platforms are providing you with, and then when you’re communicating, you’ve got to figure out who your audience is. Because if you don’t know who you’re talking to, then you don’t know how to tailor your content towards them. So that’s really what our number one priority is to make sure we know who we’re talking to with every post. You could be talking to different people in different posts, that’s absolutely fine, because you’ve got a wide range of people that you are communicating with. And one message doesn’t necessarily resonate with all of them. But different messages might resonate with different people. So as long as you’re ticking those boxes and you’re and the messaging you’re doing is varied to meet the needs of those who are looking at your content, then you’re on the right track.

Carlota Pico 15:28
Okay, what about as a former journalist, what are some story telling techniques that you would offer to our audience to help them guide through their social network challenges?

Payam Edelat 15:42
There is one number one rule and I think I touched on it briefly, and that is people. You just have to make sure that whatever you do, you’ve got people at the heart of everything that you’re posting. Wherever you’re working for a news story, say, you know, it’s some government policy, you know, there’s the government policy and you’re telling, now giving the update, you have to tell people how it affects them. And it’s exactly the same with what we do at PMI, on our social media, is we are communicating that, you know, this is our, this is our change, but this is how it could affect you directly. So that’s that’s really, really important is that you put people at the center of everything you do. You’ve got to think about the type of content that you would personally engage with. What was the last thing that you shared 0that was made by third party? I would guarantee you share that because it triggered some sort of emotion: it made you happy or made you sad or laugh or gave you a sense of pride. Emotions, or what we all have in common, so you’ve got to try and include it in your work.

Carlota Pico 16:51
Beautifully put—emotions is what we all have in common. I couldn’t agree with that more. Okay, so I’m going to throw a curveball at you. What are your thoughts on TikTok and Microsoft’s potential new acquisition of TikTok, because I mean, they’re going from one spectrum, from one side of the spectrum to the other side of the spectrum. Microsoft bought LinkedIn, but TikTok is all about generation Z consumers. It’s a completely different type of audience.

Payam Edelat 17:20
Yeah, no, it’s actually really exciting to watch because there’s… it does two things for me. It not only feeds the part of my brain that’s interested in social media, but it also feeds my sort of news junkie brain as well, because there’s so much in it, you know, there’s the whole you know, China’s relations with the US come in and with the West in general, you bring Trump into it and his comments, you know, that he wants the US public to have a cut of the sale. So it’s fascinating. It really is fascinating, but it’s not, you know, unheard of, for big companies, huge, recognizable companies to find these newcomers, and take them over. We saw the same with Instagram when Facebook took it over. You know, it’s been the same with MySpace. It’s what happens a bit next that’s really fascinating because it’s whether Microsoft will then take TikTok and you know, bring it up to a level like Instagram and Facebook and Twitter and bring it up to that to that stage or wherever it takes it and changes it to something that doesn’t appeal to its initial audience anymore. We’re gonna remember TikTok why it started and it’s extraordinary the way that it sort of exploded and I would love to see it sort of continue to evolve. It’d be really sad to see it go away because it’s engaged a whole new generation. We’re sharing stories. Yes, you know, social medi addiction is a huge problem. And we’ve got to be mindful of, you know, restricting access of young people to buy time, you know, you know, you want them to have a varied life of going outside and education, all of this. But essentially what TikTok is, it’s another storytelling platform. And it’s exciting that another young generation are finding new and creative ways to communicate a story. So I’d love for it to sort of be taken over by Microsoft and turned into something really amazing.

Carlota Pico 19:24
Yeah, I’m actually really excited to see what Microsoft is going to do with TikTok just because I mean, they acquired LinkedIn which is a completely B2B type of platform for professionals, right business professionals, and now it wants to acquire—or rumor is that it wants to acquire TikTok—and I don’t really know how that’s going to fit into their business model. So I’m quite curious.

Payam Edelat 19:46
Yeah, yeah. It is exciting because when you think of Microsoft, you think business, you think LinkedIn, you don’t think you know, fun-loving sort of videos of people singing and mouthing songs. It’d be fascinating to see whether they will give it a more of a sort of adult feel to it, or whether they just sort of keep it separate completely, and let it develop in its own way. But it is really exciting to watch.

Carlota Pico 20:12
It might be their way of tapping into the new generations as well, and getting them to back the Microsoft brand through TikTok.

Payam Edelat 20:18
Yeah, absolutely. Because I mean, Xbox was another—I think that was their first attempt to try and to get into that younger generation. And it was very successful, you could argue, but there’s a lot of competition. Whereas TikTok, I think, there is a lot of competition with social media, but specifically with short video sharing and this sort of thing, it’s a very unique platform.

Carlota Pico 20:45
Yeah. Or it could also just be a phase, right? I mean, we saw Snapchat going off the rails, I mean, just skyrocketing, and everybody using it, and it was like a buzzword. And then all of a sudden, people were just over it. So I guess time will tell. Okay, to finish off the section of the interview, I’d like to ask you for your advice for recent graduates. So let’s say you had to do it all over again: what would you change? And what have you learned?

Payam Edelat 21:16
Don’t be afraid to take time out. So that’s definitely what I did, I took time out, I was going to go into law before I went to Sky so when I was doing my A Levels, and I applied for this internship, if I didn’t get it, I would have studied law somewhere. And I would’ve been working in a law practice and I can’t think of you know—no offense to all my lawyer friends and all the lawyers out there who might be watching—but really, it’s probably wouldn’t have been for me. I would have not enjoyed my life. So don’t be afraid to take some time out. Spend some time thinking about really what it is that you want. I had friends on my a journalism degree who left a career medicine, left a career in law because they were sort of forced into going down that route, but it wasn’t what they wanted to do. So really think about what it is that you want to do. And take some time out—take a year out go and explore, maybe do a couple internships or you know, work, some work experience in whatever the industry is that you are considering but might not be your first choice at the moment to figure out because, you know, you’re making a decision that’s gonna set the path for the rest of your life so make sure it’s the one that will keep you happy.

Carlota Pico 22:30
Yeah, gosh, that’s kind of sends like chills up my arms. I already made my decision but still like what a hard decision to make!

Payam Edelat 22:37
Yeah, it’s huge, it’s huge, isn’t it? There’s so much pressure on young people who are coming out of A Levels deciding, you know, I keep saying A Levels, but are they called a levels everywhere else? I don’t know. College. College is what I mean. Yeah, yeah. Well, coming out of education, full time education and they don’t know what to do. They’re being pressured from parents from teachers all around them telling them: “This is what you’ve go to do, this is what you’ve got to do!” But you don’t want them to silence a little voice in their own heads.

Carlota Pico 23:05
Yeah, definitely. Sorry, A Levels refers to high school, for our audience.

Payam Edelat 23:11
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. The stage before University diplomas and whatnot.

Carlota Pico 23:16
Yeah. Because in the States, I was, I went to university in the States and university can be substituted for college as well, so it’s college or university, basically it’s a BA, right? It’s a degree, a bachelor’s degree, normally, or whatever type of degree, but A Level tends to be your high school, and that’s where…

Payam Edelat 23:35
The trouble comes in then because high school we would do our GCSE and then, you would, go on to do your A Levels for another two years. But I’m sure you know the stage before you get your BA is what I’m referring to, yeah.

Carlota Pico 23:49
I mean, this is a perfect case of how culture plays a role in story telling and in content, right? You say A Levels, I say high school, somewhere else says international baccalaureate, the IB levels, right? So, this is a perfect case of how to tie it all together right to the beginning of our conversation. Okay, moving into our set of rapid fire questions, it’s basically recommendations to our audience. To get this section started off, Payam, I’d like to ask you about your source of inspiration. So a professional role model, an influencer—someone who has really impacted you throughout your career.

Payam Edelat 24:23
There is a…so okay, when you say rapid fire, how quick do my answers need to be?

Carlota Pico 24:31
Like two seconds!

Payam Edelat 24:33
Okay. There’s a journalist called Jon Snow, he’s Channel Four in the UK. When I was little, I was always watching him on TV.

Carlota Pico 24:42
Okay, very sweet. Actually, my, my equivalent would be Katie Couric from CBS Evening News. That’s who I was watching when I was younger, and I actually interned for CBS Evening News later on in my career while I was stillin university, so it was like a nice little full circle.

Payam Edelat 24:59
Yeah, but Jon Snow, he’s brilliant. He’s known for his colorful socks and ties. So yeah, he’s a really colorful character. I haven’t met him yet. I wish I’d met him in my journalism days. He might not want to meet me, though, I don’t know.

Carlota Pico 25:14
Well, the world needs more colors. So… okay, what about a book, a group or publication that you’d like to recommend

Payam Edelat 25:23
A book that I would recommend… I’ve recently finished—there’s two. So Frank McCourt’s “Angela’s Ashes, beautiful book about growing up in Ireland and, you know, in poverty, really beautiful. And then he goes on for the sequel, which isn’t as good, but you sort of need to see what happens next. And then the other thing is Home Going by Yaa Gyasi, which is a stunning book. The use of language to create an image in your head is outstanding. So those are two books.

Carlota Pico 25:53
Okay, beautiful, and to finish up this session, and also the last question of today’s intervie: what’s your favorite app of the most lanes and why

Payam Edelat 26:01
I really like Ground News. They are very tailored to your sort of interests. And it’s something that I look at every morning, they send me notifications at I think it’s 7:30 or 8 AM. And it’s the first thing I read every time whenever I wake up every morning.

Carlota Pico 26:21
Okay, excellent, well Payam thank you so much for joining us on The Content Mix. It was awesome to pick your brain and to learn about your experience.

Payam Edelat 26:28
It’s been my pleasure. Thank you so much for having me.

Carlota Pico 26:31
And thank you everyone for listening in today. For more perspectives on the content marketing industry in Europe, check out The Content Mix.. We’ll be releasing interviews just like this one every week, so keep on tuning in! Thanks again, have a fabulous day and see you next time. Bye!

Transcribed by https://otter.ai